Trapdoor Rifles

My old freind is parting with two more pieces of which I will buy. First is a well travelled trapdoor carbine. Second is a Rolling block navy marked carbine. The RB he feels has had the butt replaced and for sure has been blued by someone. Navy anchor on barrel w/serial but no receiver markings. It's in 50/45 caliber he told me. Is this just a 50/to case with 45 gns of powder or is it an actual shortened 50/70 case along the lines of the RB navy pistols. And he has two of those too...one minty and the other very well used.But he is not parting with those pistols. He is asking $1500 for the pair. Not exactly a stellar deal , but I like the pieces and he is a great old timer that's always been solid so I really cant say no.

Double check the rolling block carbine. Dixie gun works has large number of anchor marked carbine barrels some years ago and sold them a friend bought one and put it on a action for a shooter.

The barrel is serialed 4365 . Buttstock is lighter colored than forestock with sling swivel. Band on forestock has sling swivel . From the pics he sent me on the phone looks like a brass spanner screw of some sort - no disc though on r/s of butt. He said he it looked like it was made from parts. definitely the right rear and front sights. It may be an original barreled action - just kinda restored . Dont know until I get it in hand. I have handled the trapdoor carbine - it's definitely a rifle that was there and did that, with nice bore. I can text anyone the pics via phone - just cant get them to the PC via phone until a figure out the issue between them.

I did watch a midway larry potterfield video on the navy rolling block 50/45 and it's apparently 3/10's of an inch shorter case than the 50/70. It might even have been rechambered for 50/70 as apparently alot were later on. I dont think my friend ever shot it so it may very well be.He is in his late 70's and starting to part with things sadly. His only child said she had no use for his collection , though he has some stuff earmarked for his grandkids , and daughter too.

Most of the USN Model 1867 .50-45 rolling block carbines were bought by the surplus guys (SH&G or someone) and they had a customer who wanted some rolling blocks in some other caliber (.43 Spanish??) so they pulled the bbls and forends from the USN carbines, fitted new bbls and forends and sold the "guns" to their clients, but the barrels ended up clunking around with parts guys for decades.

I've seen a number of the barrels turn up (usually very nice) on somewhat doggy butts and receivers. I had one as a "filler" for a while but after many years found a completely original USN carbine, although condition is not as nice as I would like.

Correction on the fate of the M1867 USN carbines.
Ed Hull's magnificent anthology of his superb articles has a section dealing with 1867 USN carbines. INCLUDING details of the disposition of them.

Of the 5,000 initially made some 1,700+ were broken down, with the barrels ending up on the surplus market. He also details who did that, and the surplus sales of many other 1867 carbines in both original .50 caliber configuration and various alterations.

Really, folks, if you are interested in trapdoors, Ed's three volumes are "the rest of he story" on small arms developments which were competitors at the design level with the trapdoor action, and later the commercial competition in the military and civilian market place. Most people are familiar with the Remington rolling blocks, but Ed's work reveals MANY other unfamiliar inventors, makers, sellers and buyers.

Just go to Amazon and search for "ANTIQUE FIREARMS 1849 – 1899" and buy the full set.

I don't get anything for plugging these other than the satisfaction of sharing the availability of great information, comparable to and complementary to Al Frasca's definitive two volumes on "The .45-70 Springfield."